Set upgrade advice

[skyfox500]

Species:Aisha
Level : 37
Max HP: 74
Strength : AWESOME (71)
Defence : AWESOME (68)


Current Set:
Enchanted Wooden Bow
Scarab Ring
Greater Healing Scroll
Downsize!
Von Roo Dice
Golden Compass
Amulet of Inevitable Betrayal
Black Frost Cannon


Decent Weapons in SDB:
Earthen Scorchstone, purple sticky hand, leaf shield

current Budget:780k

I'm not looking to change species, I have the lab but don't use it on this pet, and I battle mostly 1 player.

I was going to get a hp, but I thought there might be some smaller upgrades that would be currently more useful. Any help?

[Shattered Rift]

Define "mostly" doing One Player.


I'm able to give better advice for One Player than I am for Two Player, and I'll attempt to include comments along the way that would pertain to Two Player.

Train. You're very close to the 85 Boosts. (However, keep in mind that, strictly One Player speaking, Defense Boosts are just a waste of time and NPs.)

The Enchanted Wooden Bow, Scarab Ring, Von Roo Dice, and Amulet of Inevitable Betrayal do nothing for you in One Player (Scarab Ring and the Amulet shine only in Two Player). Likewise, the Golden Compass shines in Two Player, but as far as One Player goes it's overpriced. Two Ice Clubs would do just as well against most Opponents. If you care about variety, Stone Club runs a tad more expensive. Leaf Shield eats the majority of both in Two Player. Your Von Roo Dice aren't doing anything for you either way, and neither is your Enchanted Wooden Bow. Earth Faerie Slingshot offers a better icon variety to Enchanted Wooden Bow (in Two Player).


Honey Potion shines against frozen Opponents. Normally I'd advise against it entirely, as I see it as overrated (I miss how it was four years ago when it was a nearly perfect item). However, I'm struggling on this one. Under the assumption you ran two nine-iconers, the Honey Potion would add another fourth to one attack you make. On the other hand, so will the 85 Boost over your 55 Boost (which would be cheaper). Part of me wants to suggest Scuzzys Comb, as it's the cheapest ten-iconer, but I'm not sure how they fare in Two Player, and in One Player the cash would be better put to training.

[VermontHermit]

I'm going to disagree with Shattered concerning defense in general in one player. Defense in my opinion is VERY valuable in one player, fully as much so as in two-player and maybe more. In two-player you don't know what your opponent has, and at the level you're at, by the time you figure out what his weapons are, the fight is likely to be over. In one-player you KNOW what the oppenent has, you know what the one or two weapons that can most hurt you are, and you can use your defensive and dual-duty weapons to neutralize them. Also, you'll never get an elite battle pet (unless you have a virtually unlimited budget, which your set doesn't indicate that you do) unless you train defense. Yes, there are full icon blockers in the game, but they aren't inexpensive. I don't have a problem with the Honey Potion, as you've already spent 375-400k to get the chance of a freeze. If you're lucky enough to get one, you need to have the ability to make it pay off, and I really don't see a lot of firepower at the top end of your battleset. Yes, the Honey Potion is a "typical" move, but it's "typical" because it's logical and effective. A Winged Scarab is the only thing that I see you getting that you might use for awhile that's substantially cheaper than the Honey Potion, and which can make a difference for you.

[skyfox500]

Shattered Rift Wrote:Define "mostly" doing One Player.

largely DoN battles, occasionally 2p battles for fun



My goal was to train to 85 boost, but I put it off to get the hp. thanks to both of you

[Shattered Rift]

VermontHermit Wrote:I'm going to disagree with Shattered concerning defense in general in one player. Defense in my opinion is VERY valuable in one player, fully as much so as in two-player and maybe more.

I'm going to rebutt your disagreement.

Most of the time in One Player you're fighting an Opponent with a Strength Boost stronger than your Defense Boost (unless you specifically train Defense higher, but even then it's still generally true), and their Strength Boost is going to pour extra damage over your Defense Boost. Shields tend to become effectively worthless in this regard, and most dual-duties are blocking less damage than you could deal extra if you were running the extra icons instead (since it's generally a trade-off, though less so at the low-end that Skyfox is at). You end up fighting a slower battle (unless you decide to Fierce, which is a double-edged sword with dual-duties), and the fight becomes far more reliant on luck.

In One Player, you're taking one of two aims: either to max out, or to defeat an Opponent for DoN or an Avatar. In the former case, dual-duties are completely worthless due to the extreme difference in Boosts. In the latter, the extreme difference in Boosts is usually present from the start.


Edit: On a bit of reflection, I'm starting to reconsider part of my stance (so long as you have a Defense Boost equal to your Strength Boost). The fact definitely exists that if you train your Strength and HP (ignoring Defense) that it allows you to make One Player progress much more quickly (and saves money).

[VermontHermit]

Shattered - I'm not going to disagree that a typical war opponent as an example (rememeber wars - Neopets used to have them) will start out weak, and will get progressively stronger, and at some point will probably have a strength boost over your defensive boost, at least early in your career.   However, that doesn't mean that defense is worthless, nor that you aren't staying around longer against that opponent than you would without it.   LONG fights and SLOWER BATTLES are exactly what you want if you're using defense.   The more rounds you last for, the more wins you'll get.   And MANY lower level one-player opponents don't have healers, or have ineffective ones.   Wearing them down (as they wear you down) and then outhealing them is an advantage).    
    Also, if you don't train defense, you never get to have an equal defense boost with an opponent's strength.   Each time you get a defensive boost (assuming you use defense, defensive weapons and or dual-duties), ALL of your weapons of that type have become more effective, and you stay equal or better than your opponent's strength boost for several more fights.  
    I'm not saying that you've painted a totally inaccurate picture, but rather a very incomplete one that has lead to a misassumption.  Personally, I went through the whole process and now have the 700 defensive boost.   It is NOT worthless.   And at this point, for MANY, MANY rounds against opponents, my defense is stronger than their strength, and it works in a very virtuous cycle when that's that case.  Unfortunately if you stop training defense, you never get to that point.   I very much encourage training defense, and I think the savings of avoiding it is a bit of an illusion, as many people focus just on offense, and as such, offensive weapons cost much more than defensive or dual-duty weapons that are AT LEAST equally as good.   Take for example the lowly Scarab Ring for under 2,000 nps.   If you've trained defense and you're going up against a player with even strength who has a roughly 1,000,000 np Sword of Apocalypse, and head-to-head, your Scarab Ring will outpoint it.  
    You battles may be quicker if you train just strength and hit points, but unless your wallet is enormously full, you'll be less successful over the long-run with that approach.   One final note, when you get to the 700 strength level. EVERYONE has the strength boost.   At that level, there is NO advantage in strength over your opponent, and what's left to determine winner from loser are three things (size of checkbook, which equals battleset, battle ability, and DEFENSE).

[shadownight]

back to the set help, you must see that with your money the best you can do is get rid of the von roo dice, amulet of inevitable betrayal(dual dutties arent very good for 1p because at your level the sugested defense vrs the 1p opponnents at idb arent expensive enough and you can sold it back) and enchanted wooden bow for a massive icon attaker or a bomb, about massive icons attaker can be a ramtors spellbook, scuzzys comb or pike pike, and theres only a bomb of intermediate level and its inflated over your budget: Honey Potion, but you decide wich you will do

[rabid_schnauzer]

Debate over the merits of defense in 1 player are fully deserving of their own thread, so I won't weigh in on that here:

skyfox500 Wrote:Species:Aisha
Level : 37
Max HP: 74
Strength : AWESOME (71)
Defence : AWESOME (68)


Current Set:
Enchanted Wooden Bow
Scarab Ring
Greater Healing Scroll
Downsize!
Von Roo Dice
Golden Compass
Amulet of Inevitable Betrayal
Black Frost Cannon


Decent Weapons in SDB:
Earthen Scorchstone, purple sticky hand, leaf shield

current Budget:780k

I'm not looking to change species, I have the lab but don't use it on this pet, and I battle mostly 1 player.

I was going to get a hp, but I thought there might be some smaller upgrades that would be currently more useful. Any help?

Honey Potion is probably your best bet overall, but as for smaller upgrades, ditch the Von Roo Dice While a decent starter weapon with nice low-level icon types, they're fractional enough that they average less than the similarly priced Battle Ready Pencil Box. Until you reach the 85 boost in Str or Defense, Fighting Folder may also be a consideration.

Likewise, you can well afford to upgrade your other offensive multiuse weapon Enchanted Wooden Bow is a great deal [i]for the price[/idb], but you can easily afford to upgrade more to a 9-iconer such as Stone Club, Ice Club, or P's Fighting Fan. Even the 8.66 icon Tyrannian Lupe Tooth is a notable increase in damage. You may even want to upgrade to the 10 icon level, as Scuzzys Comb is currently relatively cheap and you could get a pair for well under your current budget.

As to beating DoN in particular, you may wish to pick up some single use weapons such as Thick Smoke Bomb, Shooting Star Muffin and Jade Elixir to give you an edge in the tougher fights. Likewise the fragile Scroll of Freezing and fragile 50% reflectors Shovel Plus, Double Dryer and Dual Battle Mirror can be of use against certain DoN opponents.

In general a strategy something like this works well against the DoN opponents:

Round 1: Wpn + Wpn + Diamond Dust (Fiery Gaze is almost as good)
repeat round 1 until you get the lucky freeze (and sometimes until you steal a key weapon and/or your opponent uses their heal in the 1st round)

Round 2: Muffin(or other bomb) + Wpn * Fierce Attack (or Berserk)

Round 3: Wpn + Scroll of Freezeing +Burrow

Round 4: Muffin(or other bomb) + Wpn * Fierce Attack (or Berserk)

Round 5: Wpn + Downsize! + Species Ability

Round 6: Wpn + Wpn + Sink

Round 7: Wpn + Healer + Species Ability

Round 8: Wpn + Thick Smoke Bomb + Species Ability

Obviously you may have to modify the order of rounds after 4 depending on your current hit points, and not all DoN opponents are slowed by both Sink and Burrow, but the general pattern should let you survive 6 to 8 rounds against most of the opponents.